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  #21  
Old 12-01-2006, 08:48 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

i see what you're saying. i have few difficulties understanding mechanics of things. my thing is, if the air is encouraged to go the way of the striker, since there is a ball in the breech, the valve would be open a very slightly shorter time, because the air pushes the striker back faster. if it doesn't recock, the striker was not pushed back with as much force, and would keep the valve pin depressed slightly longer... which, if the pressure is great enough, would force it back to be recocked, and still use more air. but since there's no ball, it keeps venting out the barrel, instead of forcing the striker back.

i think my theory is even more complicated than yours lol
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  #22  
Old 12-01-2006, 08:58 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

You kinda got it. The backpressure air doesn't really make the striker reset quicker, just aids it in reseting. Without the aid, it doesn't have the force to push all the way back.
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  #23  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:02 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

exactly. which leaves the valve open slightly longer, right? not a lot, but enough to make a difference over a few hundred dry fires.
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  #24  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:13 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

Nope. The valve opens, and closes, at the same amount when you have it shooting with or without balls at the same velocity. You have to remember that the valve pin is slotted, and allows air out the back whether or not it's open.
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  #25  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:31 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

Maybe I can clear this up. When there is no ball in the breech and a shot is taken, it uses more propellant because there is nothing stopping the pressure including the LPC storage from depleating as much as it can for the duration of the dwell time. W/A ball in the barrel, the ball is actually buffering/blocking the maximum flow of pressure for that quick ms and by the time the ball leaves the barrel the valve is closed. Less pressure has been used because the valve is closed before the ball that's blocking the maximum flow of pressure has left the barrel -

Far as the striker goes, the same thing applies. The ball is blocking the freed up escape of pressure so it has to go somewhere and in this instance the path of flow to the striker is another escape route for the pressure. With no ball in the barrel there is a large gaping path for the pressure through the barrel. When involving gasses or liquids under pressure, the largest escape orifice is where the majority of gas or fluids will escape -
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  #26  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:39 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

So we were right up except for the part about the ball barricading and not allowing more air, which inturn uses less air.

We were trying.
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  #27  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:41 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

I still disagree, but eh, I can't prove myself.

I have to clear this up though, Drago: are you an engineer?
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  #28  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:45 PM
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I think you were correct but maybe didn't think about the cup seal blocking the pressure as well as the ball -

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Nope, they only let me ride in the caboose because I drive too fast lol -
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  #29  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:52 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

Hmm, thought just occured to me. The ball's blockage would be affected by none other than the barrel's bore. The fit around the ball would determine how much air required to push it out the barrel, and thus how much air is used. So I might just be right... I'd have to test it, though. But... I'm not willing to do that short of a paycheck, haha!


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I think you were correct but maybe didn't think about the cup seal blocking the pressure as well as the ball -
And 'tis must be late at night if you're getting things backwards again.... lol.... So, if you don't drive the train, then you must be a machinist? I'ma keep guessing until I figure it out because it keeps bugging the hell out of me!
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  #30  
Old 12-01-2006, 11:09 PM
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Default Re: 1385+ shots = 68/4500

The barrel to paint( I said that bass ackwards didn't I?) fit would only determine how much excess might be used past the point of a loose fittin ball as opposed to a tight fitting ball. That has to do with efficiency and porting comes into the equation as well. Even a loose fitting ball blocks off a maximum current of flow because it is indeed an obstruction just the same -
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