Hehehe!

[vikingshadow]

Ok, in honor of my first full day of summer vacation (let the post whoring begin!!! ) I'm opening up with this INTERESTING topic I ran into on another forum I've been visiting.

The topic: Wiping - is it cheating, or a foul? Should we, as paintballers, be concerned with honor and integrity and having fun, or should we be interested in winning, getting the girl, the money and being King of the Mountain?

I personally find these two threads eye opening in that so many people think it's ok to cheat by comparing it to other sports - an by how widespread the idea has become. I mean, some of these guys are actually FIGHTING when they say it's ok to wipe, if the situation calls for it (as if it ever could!) Using an example that seems common on these types of threads: A lineman holds someone and gets a penalty. Wiping is a foul and shouldn't be considered cheating...

BUT, let's be more realistic - when you hold in football, the other team doesn't lose a player, leaving the team a man down and thus making your team stronger. No, it just changes the field position, usually not by very much. When you wipe, and subsequently eliminate another player, their team is now at a disadvantage. Not to mention the fact that the youngun's see this and say, "Cool! That's what I'm gonna do!"

Make sure you read both complete threads linked below, and then feel free to give your thoughts. Remember, these are two completely different forums, with people from all over the country registered.

Here's the thread I found.

Here's another one I found with a slightly different point of view.

Let the discussion begin!

[emf7301]

According to the rules, if a paintball breaks on you, then your out. No ifs, ands, or buts. Wiping tries to hide the fact that you got hit and in essence is cheating because you are breaking the rules. That's my .02

[marvin-martian]

haha, we have the exact same format as pbaz.

[vikingshadow]

So no one besides emf has anything to say about this? Wow! I thought for sure this would get a rise out of someone...cough**druid**cough.....

Or is it that everyone is getting used to the idea of wipers as just a "foul" and not really anything bad????

[TheRedBarron]

I have been around the tourney scene for a LONG time now and one thing I have notice that has changed through the years is this...

when the tourney scene first opened up people would velocity ramp for greater distance and to install more pain, after awhile people started realizing how stupid that was


Then after electros were the norm people started buying "cheater boards" boards that ramped or had full auto settings that could be hidden or disguised. this was killed mostly due to PSP's ramping rule. Allowing ramping at a set speed has killed most of this type of cheating.

Now we have this wiping thing, MANY big tourney ballers feel that wiping is just like a foul as you said. I personally feel that if we allow it to be just a foul and have a sufficient penalty just like in football holding or a face mask ranges from 5 - 15 yards. Have a 2-1 or 3-1 more likely a 2-1 but still don't ridicule the wiper, yes its wrong but so isn't a intentional face mask, that person doesn't get flack from everyone it just puts his team at a disadvantage.

So overall cheating has been an issue with our sport since it started, if we accept it and apply the correct punishment and take it as a foul then our sport will be able to continue. If we start kicking out every player that has ever wiped a hit then our sport will slowly become like curling, completely safe with less then .5% of the population playing it.

[Hossy]

i think wiping can be practiced...and if they do it there should be a huge penalty if cought....and like vike said

"when you hold in football, the other team doesn't lose a player, leaving the team a man down and thus making your team stronger. No, it just changes the field position, usually not by very much. When you wipe, and subsequently eliminate another player, their team is now at a disadvantage. Not to mention the fact that the youngun's see this and say, "Cool! That's what I'm gonna do!""

well I agree that it changes the whole game...but its just that game, BUT WIPING SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED...IMO if a team gets cought for wiping they should be out of the tourney that there in. it shouldnt be allowed.

I was playing woodsball with a group of 25 kids, for a younger friend of mines birthday party. i honestly was the best one there, and most expirenced, being one of the only ones that have played before. some kids watched PB on ESPN2 and all, and hear the ppl wiping, and they did it. i light up some kid with about 5 balls(woodsball sorry i didnt know if they hit them.) and well he wiped all 5 balls, by the time the ref came. they were bad wipes, one was on the mask and he only got part of it, which the ref called him out, and he had to sit out a game because he wiped

but back on track. i think that the team that wipes should get thrown out of the tourney, because if they cheat its not fair, so i think that it would be good in the name of paintball, so they get more airtime and all, that they have stricker rules

my bottom line: If a kid is watching Paintball on TV, professional paintball, and they see wiping and all they will do it. its like a child who is brought up doing drugs or whatever, they will most likely do drugs.

thats just my 2 cents

[druid]

Originally Posted by vikingshadow

So no one besides emf has anything to say about this? Wow! I thought for sure this would get a rise out of someone...cough**druid**cough.....

Or is it that everyone is getting used to the idea of wipers as just a "foul" and not really anything bad????

HEH HEH....you thought you'd catch me ...

I think it's widely known what my ideas of fair-play are...

I've never wiped, I've called a ref over and if (s)he deems it a 'safe' then they wipe it or tell me to and I'll do it. I've called myself out even when the mark was less than a quarter...based upon how the hit 'felt' (solid hit) + mark = I didn't cover well enough to not be marked.

I don't ramp...even when allowed by the rules. I like unlimited semi alot and that's all my TBoard's have ever seen. Right now my Ion's set to 30bps uncapped semi and the tourney lock is only a dip-switch away.

Hot marker - twice in my lifetime I've run hot...but were never intentional. They were hot summer days and I was using CO2. Now, I figured that when I chrono'd at 260 (field limit of 280), the 20fps was a 'good enough' buffer zone. Apparently not. So I was sent back to tech area to fix the situation...no problem. It's part of the game and a hazard of using CO2.

Wipers on the other team - causes an issue with me because of my own ethics. It puts me into a moral dilema that I have a hard time justifying. I'm totally against intentional bonus balling but when I see a wiper...I light them up and I do them ugly. At 17-19bps, it makes it hard to wipe half that...so I make sure they need a few gallons of water to make it look like they weren't hit. Is it right? No, not in my eyes but what's the alternative? Let them do it and get away with it? I can't allow that either. This is why I play more rec than anything else. It seems that rec players are more honest than tourney ballers and we have the Lasoya types to thank for this.

[vwjimmy]

Originally Posted by druid

Wipers on the other team - causes an issue with me because of my own ethics. It puts me into a moral dilema that I have a hard time justifying. I'm totally against intentional bonus balling but when I see a wiper...I light them up and I do them ugly. At 17-19bps, it makes it hard to wipe half that...so I make sure they need a few gallons of water to make it look like they weren't hit. Is it right? No, not in my eyes but what's the alternative? Let them do it and get away with it? I can't allow that either. This is why I play more rec than anything else. It seems that rec players are more honest than tourney ballers and we have the Lasoya types to thank for this.

I know exactly what you mean......
I don't do the tourney thing anymore but even rec balling I see some wipers...
Makes me want to empty my hopper into them, and sometimes I do hit 'em enough to make sure.....
Man, I hate it when I do that as bad as I hate it when I get bonused....
I'm too old and slow to cheat, I don't even want to ever, and I have to sleep at night!
Wiping is for the weak minded, those who forgot that winning is a reward for solid play, skill and good luck. Besides, what comes around goes around and the luck of the wipers always sucks in the end.....
thats my .02.....

[bamf-hacker]

wiping is cheating... PERIOD!!!

If you wiped a hit off it is because you actually got hit.... Which means you are out.

A foul would be giving a live player paint as you walked off the field...

My .02

HacKeR

[Team Ramrod]

the point of the game is to mark the other player. If you get marked and wipe it than you have cheated, period. Its the same thing as in a hockey game after someone scores, you take the puck out of the net and tell them it was never in and deny them the point.

There is no middle ground, no place where it is acceptable, if you wipe, you cheat, no foul, straight up cheating and i dont know how anyone can defend otherwise.