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View Full Version : HP and LP HPA Questions


Alex228
02-01-2007, 09:43 PM
I though I had this HP and LP down for HPA tanks but somebody told me something that didn't seem right to me. However, he said he was a tank fill person at his local field.

I want to buy a HPA tank for the Proto Matrix Rail(PMR). From what I've read they run very low pressure. Now from my understanding, LP tanks cannot or better said, should not operate in marker that operate above 450psi. From my understanding, HP tanks could handle any marker, so if one was to use a HP HPA tank with a Spyder it would work fine, and also if one was to use that same tank on a Low pressure marker such as the PMR then it would also work. Therefore one should not use a LP HPA tank on a stock Spyder because Spyders normally operate around 800psi, thus exceeding the recommended operable psi of 450.

Well this person told me that it really made no difference nowdays. He said that it was fine to use a LP HPA tank on a Spyder, that it made no difference. Well my thing is, how can a 800psi Spyder operate on an LP HPA tank. If from my understandings should not exceed 450psi.

I hope this made sense, I tried to be as clear as possible. I just want to know if I can use the same tank both with a Spyder and a PMR, safely. The tank is a 68/45 Crossfire tank. If you could educate me a bit more on the subject that would be great, and also if both work, which one is more efficient.

Smoke
02-01-2007, 10:32 PM
The pressure setting is the output pressure that the tank runs at. Examples, an HP tank provides air at approx 800 psi while a LP tank will provide output air at approx 450 psi (Exact pressure depends on the reg on your tank). Most markers will be fine with an HP tank - spyders definitely. If you read up on the PMR it will let you know the recommended input pressure.

There are a some high end markers that require either an LP tank and/or you need to modify or replace the stock reg on the gun. Example - newer angels (circa 04 and newer). The reg on those guns is designed for a lower input pressure.

I personally run a crossfire LP output tank on my shocker. I can run either HP or LP but have found it to work well for me. If you do go with an LP output tank, make sure it has a high enough recharge rate for rapid fire. Crossfire regs are pretty good at this.

I hope this helps - Smoke, aka Mark

Alex228
02-01-2007, 11:09 PM
So what I said was sorta of right? If the Spyder runs at 800psi, it cannot shoot with a LP tank on it. I was looking at the PMR manual and it says output pressure should be between 450-800psi, that doesnt sound right to me. I think I remember someone saying a number way lower than that.

Smoke
02-02-2007, 01:35 AM
you are correct, a stock spyder will not operate properly using an LP tank.
On your PMR, I believe it should either have read input pressure to your reg, or it meant output pressure from the tank.

Best of luck - Smoke, aka Mark

vikingshadow
02-02-2007, 04:28 AM
The pressure setting is the output pressure that the tank runs at. Examples, an HP tank provides air at approx 800 psi while a LP tank will provide output air at approx 450 psi (Exact pressure depends on the reg on your tank). Most markers will be fine with an HP tank - spyders definitely. If you read up on the PMR it will let you know the recommended input pressure.

The PMR doesn't really recommend either tank. However, from what I've read, it can handle either tank. With the hyper II being one of the best regs out there, and the crossfire tank having a great reg on it, you should be ok.

There are a some high end markers that require either an LP tank and/or you need to modify or replace the stock reg on the gun. Example - newer angels (circa 04 and newer). The reg on those guns is designed for a lower input pressure.

Newer Angels can run perfectly fine on HP tanks. It's the 04 Speed and those around it that need to have a LP tank because the reg on those was designed that way. There are mods you can do to those regs to allow high pressure (I used one on my 04 Speed and was just fine after the reg mods.)
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I agree with him on the recharge rate - if the reg on the gun and the tank can recharge fast enough, you should being fine with an LP tank.

Smoke
02-02-2007, 01:40 PM
Thanks for the correction on the newest angels. I knew the 04 Speeds and the A4 needed the LP, wasn't sure if they had corrected on the newest models.

crux
02-02-2007, 05:46 PM
^indeed. What these fine fellows are saying is correct (I believe). I use to be in the exact same position as yourself. I also had a spyder, and I also purchased a pmr not too long ago. I have a 48ci 3000psi tank (hp), and it has worked flawlessly with both markers. As I understand it, only a limited amount of markers require a lp tank (like vike suggested, the earlier angels are a example of these). Most modern markers (including the pmr and spyders) will work with hp.
I do believe that the only differentiating factor between a hp and lp marker is the reg. The reg will regulate the pressure entering the marker, and if the input pressure is too high for a lp marker's reg to handle, then it will not operate correctly, thus a lp tank is required. On the other hand, a reg on a hp marker (pmr, spyder) is manufactured to handle high pressure, and will work with a hp tank. When the pressure coming in is too low (lp) then the marker will fail to "seal" properly, and you will experience leaks. The operating pressure of the marker is somewhat irrelevant to to the input pressure of your tank (basically, even though the operating pressure of your marker seems low, around the 150psi mark, it doesn't automatically mean it requires a lp tank).
Now, with that said, make sure that you don't adjust the input pressure on your pmr regulator too high, otherwise the pressure in the marker will be too high, and you may blow a o-ring or two (this tends to happen with the pmr for the factory setting on the reg is really high (around 320fps)). So just watch for that, and check to make sure that when you change the velocity of your reg, that you don't make it too low, otherwise the marker wont have enough pressure to seal, thus causing leaks.
Anywhoo, hope that what i have here is relevant and accurate (please correct me if I'm wrong).
Best of luck with your tank, and welcome too the pmr family:) (that crossfire should work fine).

vikingshadow
02-02-2007, 07:41 PM
On a side note, many manufacturers are now making regs that can either be adjusted from HP to LP, or switched over with just a spring by the user. Very handy if you have multiple guns that require different tanks. I know my ACI Bulldog reg is adjustable with just a spring kit, which is very cool.

Just something you might be interested in looking into.