PDA

View Full Version : LP woes


Hob Hayward
04-02-2006, 12:46 PM
My current marker
05 imagine
NDZ HP valve
Palmer male stabilizer
Drilled out VA
ACS bolt
Worr Gas 3000/50 (brand new)
Halo TSA
teardrop

So, the problem is Reocking, I cannot get it to properly recok at lp with HPA, it won't recock below 600psi, although it'll get lower with co2.... but still only 400-500 there, used a light valve, light main and light valve heavy main... My sear, my bolt and my striker are all polished (yes I polished a delrin bolt... It has great seal on it though)

Any thoughts?

shunut
04-02-2006, 01:07 PM
I'd say valve or VA, or a combo of both. Modifying the stock VA works but it all depends on how much you take out. I've found it works better with an aftermarket VA, Trinity, Assault Block or the BL VA work great. As for the valve, I've never heard good things about the NDZ valve, actually, I'm pretty sure I've heard others with the same valve have the same problem. Should have went with a Rocket Valve or an AKA Tornado Valve.

Hob Hayward
04-02-2006, 03:01 PM
Hmm yes. I was going to buy a madman valve, but the guy who owns a proshop near me said, I oughta get this one instead as it was better... In any case, I'm gonna try getting a madman valve instead... What I don't get is how some people ARE able to get this thing working ~300 fps at 280 psi, or around that... I wonder if Its my VA? the thing should be super high flowing, because I drilled it out completely... Maybe I'll try getting a new VA, ug, I don wanna get anew VA though, after all the effort I put into drilling and tapping, and installing the gauge in my stock one :(

ad0131065
04-02-2006, 03:06 PM
Try a new V/A before a new valve. I've heard the ndz valve was pretty good.

ooglieboogliebob
04-02-2006, 07:13 PM
now that i think about it ... the acs bolt could be the problem also .. i'v been hearing a lot of problems because of them lately ...

nitrobassboats
04-03-2006, 07:55 AM
So, the problem is Reocking, I cannot get it to properly recok at lp with HPA, it won't recock below 600psi, although it'll get lower with co2.... but still only 400-500 there, used a light valve, light main and light valve heavy main... My sear, my bolt and my striker are all polished (yes I polished a delrin bolt... It has great seal on it though)
LOL on the polisihd delrin bolt
Basically you hae the same parts as i run in im 04 Imagine at Lp (about 290psi)
the only diffrences is the stabilizer(I use a Bob Long Torpedo 0-600psi) and
a Check It Assault block(which has huge holes in it)
Shu says he had heard the NDZ hi per valve is not very good,this is not true
i use them in the Imagine and my other Spyders without a hitch and they perform fantastic.
I think it is probably the VA and this would be the first thing i d look at,then id
work my way to that stabalizer(i also have used the Bob Long torp on CO2 though its not recommended)
Hope you get it fixed soon
nitro
ps is it possible the striker or the sear is wonky in some way ????? just a thought

NB_Hacker_NB
04-03-2006, 01:05 PM
Get a CIP v/a.

Hob Hayward
04-03-2006, 03:34 PM
I read over otter's config, and he couldn't get his low end config working, till he stuck in the 32* high flowing VA, so I'm gonna get a new VA.

I'd get the CIP va, but I don't think the forward angle looks too comfortable, anyone know about the trinity 7D VA? http://www.pbreview.com/products/reviews/4214/

I'd get it, but I really don't want to buy a 40$ va and find out that it isn't high flowing enough.

Is there a VA thats high flowing, but NOT tilted out?

druid
04-03-2006, 03:42 PM
peeps......we're forgetting that compressed CO2 is more dense than compressed air. The density issue alone could be the sole reason. More often than not, when you switch to HPA you need higher flow, more psi or both.

I have seen this in my own creations...where a marker that recocks at 175 psi on CO2, won't recock with HPA until I upped it to 325 psi. I had to open the VA airways alooooooooot more.

Hob Hayward
04-03-2006, 04:28 PM
Yeah I read that on otters site, but I'm still having the problems, even though my VA has a MASSIVE hole in it, I'm guessing turbulence is my problem at this point. So new VA here I come...

druid
04-03-2006, 04:33 PM
assault block would be one of the highest flowing ones to get....

Hob Hayward
04-03-2006, 04:58 PM
Yeah, but I don't really like the 15* bit, it looks uncomforatbale, thats why I want to see if theres another thats just as good but not in the same configuration...

ooglieboogliebob
04-03-2006, 07:31 PM
get the trinity then .. it's the -10* one ...

druid
04-03-2006, 08:01 PM
yes yes...the newer Trinity...it has a conical LPC. The old Trinity has a cylindrical LPC with a roundish end and is less flowing than the newer one (or so we heard)...

ooglieboogliebob
04-03-2006, 08:20 PM
^^^... less flowing ... but not by much ... the new ones look just like the assult blocks .. just with the backwards tilt ...

Hob Hayward
04-04-2006, 11:49 AM
Yeah, I know about the trinity ones, but the question does it flow well enough? Plus they're hard to find, actionvillage has em but only in blue and yellow, or flat black, but the flat blacks sposed to scratch, I want silver, but I only know of one store to sell em, for 45$ :(...

Anyone know where ican get one for less than that and or if its gonna flow well enough for me? (I also came to the thought, perhaps the fact that the asault block is angled like it is, air shoots out of the reg and is angled towards the valve chamber because of the tilt

ooglieboogliebob
04-04-2006, 04:50 PM
they do flow well .. they're just as good as the assaultblocks but there is a slight difference ...

NitroBall
04-04-2006, 06:58 PM
Hob Hayward Yeah, but I don't really like the 15* bit, it looks uncomforatbale, thats why I want to see if theres another thats just as good but not in the same configuration...

so you have'nt used the CIP. 15*
i have used it for a long time now, it does feel good.
Using everything stock except the CIP 15* and a AKA 2 liter. I got my Electra down to 420 Psi on HPA, with no recocking issues.

Have you checked if your gauge is off ?

My setup
Electra 05
CP on/off, macroline fittings,
Aka 2 liter HP
CIP 15* AB
NDZ valve with stock cup seal.
32* light valve spring
shocktech main medium spring
Night striker XL
IPS sunbear Bolt, with a Auto cocker cocking rod,cut to fit.
Crossfire 68/4500 HPA

Best efficiency running 370 PSI @ 290 Fps
(will recock @ 280psi)

Have applied a thin layer of Nail varnish to the O'Ring grooves on the VA , valve and bolt for better seal.
Totally eliminated Blowby (but have drilled a few holes in the NDZ low rise feed neck to make sure i dont get any problems at HROF)
Using the stiffi barrel switch kit from my Arsenal G7 Fly, just got a couple of spyder breaches to fit.
Less porting on barrel which is good for LP.

Nitro

Hob Hayward
04-04-2006, 07:26 PM
Yeah, I've decided to go for the cip assualt block simply because its hard to get a trinity VA, they cost more, and I have no assurance that it'll work as well as the cip assault block will. The one place I found that sells the trinity in silver forces you to get a crappy 0-1500 psi gauge on it... Plus it costs 47$ compared to 35$. Plus I have a 0-700 gauge already... Goin cip assault block. Gonna be getting a DH titanium striker (smoother than ns xl) aswell soon. Eventually will replace my ACS with a sunbear, and grab a t-board for the eyes.

NitroBall
04-04-2006, 07:54 PM
i used a DH Titainium striker for a month, which was fine when i first used it, then recocking problems occured and noticed it had bad wearing. i could feel it was rough when slowly cocking the marker .
I tried polished out the roughness, but had recocking issues after that.
Have used the NS XL for some time now, no problems with it.
It feels a lot lighter than the DH.

Some ppl had had no problems with the DH striker, but some said they had wear problems ,could have been just a few that were bad eggs, mine was binned a long time ago.

Sunbear bolt = good choice(wish i went to them in the first place)

If you can get a measurment of the inner chamber , where your bolt goes, IPS can make the bolt to fit perfectly to your marker.

Hob Hayward
04-04-2006, 08:00 PM
Hm yeah, thats cool, maybe I will go IPS, any chance you know how to polish the INSIDE of the marker? My frickin stock bolt scratched the crap outa the top tube when I tried using it =/ It seems fine on my ACS, but I don't really want to take any chances...

Did you properly lube the DH striker when you were using it?

NitroBall
04-04-2006, 08:13 PM
ive used car polish on the inside of my marker only the once which came out pretty well, like glass.
Regards to deep scratches, i would,nt worry too much about it, as long as the bolt or striker does not catch them. Just polish out any rough surface , so theres nothing sticking up.
Just make sure u dont sand but a good polish should be fine.

And yes the DH striker was oiled and clean properly after each game.

NitroBall
04-04-2006, 08:21 PM
NAIL VARNISH**********

make sure the nail varnish is totally dry before putting O'rings back on.

*** I am not responsible for anyone trying this and messing up there marker, do this mod at your own risk****

many people have used some form of tape to get a better seal, but instead of tape i used nail varnish, and only applied a thin coat at a time until i was happy with the results.

Nitro

Hob Hayward
04-04-2006, 08:44 PM
Well... I'm not leakin so no problem there...

I have 1500 grit sandpaper so its more polishing than sanding, but I have no way to get it on the inside of the body... Plus I noticed that my striker is wearing the inside too, and that this is polished to a shine...

NitroBall
04-04-2006, 09:09 PM
i would,nt recommend using any form of sandpaper,
just use some kind of polish like i suggested previously to get a shine for smooth operation.

Hob Hayward
04-05-2006, 01:39 PM
Yeah, but I need to get out the roughness first...

ooglieboogliebob
04-05-2006, 02:10 PM
^^ ... still not a good idea ... but if you insist on doing it ... but a higher grit of sandpaper .... you'll need it ...

druid
04-05-2006, 03:21 PM
You could use 1000 grit sandpaper on the area to get rid of the roughness...then...Take half a battleswab and stick it in a drill. Add mother's mag to it and go to town.

Hob Hayward
04-06-2006, 03:26 PM
Would the mothers mag make it slick even wit hthe roughness?